Bob Bolin, in his piece from Skirting the Interface: Surface Anxiety and Gender in Cyberpunk, uses Gibson’s Burning Chrome as a vehicle to describe the overwhelming detachment of humanity in the information society. He successfully defines gender roles as presented by Gibson as being “self-referential” or “a cultural construct validated (only) by the events of the story” and contrasts that newly evolving cultural idea with the old world of “corporeal existence.”
So, what he is saying is that our reality is no longer defined by our bodies. Our use of machines to communicate through time and over longer distances changes our perceptions of reality and therefore our perceptions of self. The computer world is becoming more visceral and lively than our everyday life. And, we no longer need a physical body to exist in this world dominated by information. This destruction of the self is seen by many as obscene. How can we exist without bodies? We begin to question our “selves” and this heightens our ever increasing sense of paranoia about our ability to control our surroundings.
Bolin asks “does this flood of the obscene (in stories like Burning Chrome) terrify because of its proximity, or is it the suggestion that since man cannot figure himself in his culture, and cannot keep himself separate from what has been previously proscribed, he can no longer find a comfortable place in his culture?” Are our current customs and cultures then obsolete because they are based on “meat” rather than “information”? Can humanity exist without corporeal existence?
So, what he is saying is that our reality is no longer defined by our bodies. Our use of machines to communicate through time and over longer distances changes our perceptions of reality and therefore our perceptions of self. The computer world is becoming more visceral and lively than our everyday life. And, we no longer need a physical body to exist in this world dominated by information. This destruction of the self is seen by many as obscene. How can we exist without bodies? We begin to question our “selves” and this heightens our ever increasing sense of paranoia about our ability to control our surroundings.
Bolin asks “does this flood of the obscene (in stories like Burning Chrome) terrify because of its proximity, or is it the suggestion that since man cannot figure himself in his culture, and cannot keep himself separate from what has been previously proscribed, he can no longer find a comfortable place in his culture?” Are our current customs and cultures then obsolete because they are based on “meat” rather than “information”? Can humanity exist without corporeal existence?
23 comments:
no, humanity cannot exists without corporeal existance. as getty and i have disscussed a machine that has emotion is not alive. to be alive there are certain characteristics that must be displayed.
to be considered alive an organism must:
1.Reproduce; all organisms can copy themselves if they are only one cell in size or can copy the DNA (the genetic material) to a cell that can grown into a complete organism.
2.Grow; growing is just a single cell reproducing or copying itself by the process of mitosis. The whole organism grows by adding cells through this process.
3.have cells; their life material is assembled in little organized units built mostly out of proteins.
4.Have DNA; this genetic material is a chemical code which assembles chemicals to make the proteins that your cells are made of. The DNA molecule can also copy itself, making growth and reproduction possible.
5.Need energy; all organisms need energy for all life activities. Even thinking requires a considerable amount of energy. Plants get energy through photosynthesis, and animals get energy from cellular respiration.
6.React to their environment; all organisms can sense their environment and react to it. Even a tree grows up while the roots grow down. And leaves always grow toward the light.
7.Carry out homeostasis (maintain a constant internal environment); even though the environment around a cell can change a lot (example: hot to cold), the inside of the cell needs to stay the same. Keeping a constant internal environment is called homeostasis. For example, when you exercise, your body heats up. You then sweat to cool down to get the cell environment back to normal.
a machine may display some of these characteristics but a machine will show all of these characteristics which means that huamnity cannot exist in a machine. to be alive an organism must have a body to carry out the functions listed above.
Doesn't the post presuppose a "newly evolving cultural idea" which could not be defined by "old world" standards?
I'm having flashbacks to Sophomore science and the teacher telling me how great Galieo was to stand up to the church and say "Wait a minute, you need to look at the universe from a new perspective." Isn't that what Bolin is asking us to do?
Can't we agree that: IF people become more cybernetic, then using the current definition of humanity as a "biological" organism is like the church using the Bible to prove geocentrism? Archaic.
I challenge anyone (100 cache points) to come up with a credible list of seven characteristics which must be displayed for cyberorganisms to be considered conscious/sentient beings. Please post them here.
1. have emotion
2. dream
3. reproduce
4. have the 5 basic senses
57 points will suffice... but knowing getty... it won't...
I totally agee with Haley and not with GETTY. Machines can not be life. Everything that man creats can not have their own personallity, they will have the personallity of the person that created the machine. Thusfore anything that man has created that is not through Sex is artifical. GETTY why do you think that one day machines can be considard a human.
ok, here is the thing, i can come up with a list of human characteristics that machines can posses but that doesn't mean that they are human or even alive. so here is the list:
1.display of emotion
2.they can grow
3.use energy
4.they can carry out homeostasis
5.retain information
6.react
7.reproduce
the list above is credible by any standards, highly developed machines can obviously do all of these things, but they are not alive. the most basic unit of life is a cell, anything that does not contain cells cannot be considered alive. a person cannot put together metal and consider it living, anything a computer does it has been programmed to do. you do not have to program a living thing to feel pain or happiness. living things occur naturally and were not put together on an assembly line, they do not have to be plugged into a wall to work! no machine can be alive.
Robots can do the following things that make them have human characteristics:
1. retain information
2. react to their enviroment
3. sleep to recharge(there are robotic cats that as they sleep in the sun the sun recharges their batteries)
4. show emotion to differnt situations
5. the abliaty to have 5 sences
6. learn new things
7. Reproduce
8. have free blowing hair. (look on the web)
Robots can only be as good as the person that has made them, so thus can not do anything in which they are not program for.
i agree with Haley. machines and technology, even though can posess human "qualities", they are not "alive". machines are created with artificial intelligence, making them therefore artificial. machines do not have souls, and can not create emotion, they can react, but not create. the newly evolved standards that are being created are that technology can play a bigger role in our lives. in the story having a human be half machine symbolizes the push for society to use more technology, not to become, and encorporate it more so into our own idividual lives
Of course humanity can exist with corporeal existance. The only reason that some may be terrified of the idea is the recurring detriment of humanity itself; the fear of change, whether it be for better or for worse. Simply because a textbook says something is so does not make it absolute, and it is more ludicrous to believe something is so rather than think there is room for error. Life, for all we know, if a figment of reality, so in context the question cannot be answered. Who are we to say that life itself is anything more than just a vision? Maybe nothing exists. Perhaps it's just empty space.
1: Self-Awareness
2: Ability to learn
3: Necessity to breathe (Unless our cybernetic friend is a water-dweller)
4: Capable of emotion (Showing not necessary)
5: Ability to problem solve
6: Ability to communicate
7: Adapt to their environments
That's just a small list. More will be provided if necessary.
Sam, can you give me the link about free blowing hair.
No, that is not possible becuase of what Haley said, not having human like characteristics, and also the fact that these things would not have emotions like humans do. Also there are things in the brain that are so abstract that even scientists cant figure out why it works the way it does. For example human dreams have been something that have puzzled philosophers for thousands of years, but only recently have dreams been subjected to empirical research and concentrated scientific study. The fact that the mind can make up such vast images is astonishing. The fact that a man that has never seen in his life can sketch a fish, just un-human like abilitys that are so complex a computer could never start to understand it. Also one of the most basic principals in biology is cell = life, and all cells are created buy other living cells.
Here you go GETTY it say on http://www.nsf.gov/news/special_reports/robotics/sense.jsp that "Micromachined artificial hair cells, for example, might provide the ability to sense wind blowing or liquid flowing from different directions (see "Robots and Biology")."
There is a link on the internet that says Humans have created a robot that:
TU Delft is a pioneer of the other method used for constructing walking robots, which examines the way humans walk. This is really very similar to falling forward in a controlled fashion. Adopting this method replaces the cautious, rigid way in which robots walk with the more fluid, energy-efficient movement used by humans... Over the next few years, TU Delft intends to take major steps forward in research into walking robots. These include developing walking robots which can ‘learn’, see and run.
this information can be found on http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2008/05/080522083814
sam the link is wrong
I think your all in denial. I think its a scarey truth that machines are becoming more and more human-like. Having the ablilty to vacuum a floor without any human behind it pushing, the abiliy to make noise, to follow commands, retain information. Robots are just the very beginning of technology. Technology is growing and will continue to grow, and yes Robots need humans to design them first, but once one is made they all can benifit and learn to make themselves. Just as i believe that humans wouldnt have existed if there wasn't already a planet for our cells to develop on. And havent we developed over time, and now if we needed to, and conditions permitted, couldnt we go live on another planet, all by ourselves? I believe many people don't want to think that humanity can exist without corporeal existance because many people are preaching this. Its a frieghting thought, but its a reality as well.
Seven characteristics that must be displayed for cyberorganisms to be considered conscious/sentient beings:
1)The ablility to retain information and use the information they have learned.
2)The ability to adapt over time.
3)The ability to have reactions.
4)The ability to use and reproduce energy.
5) The ability to reproduce (they can build their own people!)
6)The ability to form a society and act as a group. (Its amazing to think of robotic cities!)
7) Breaking off of the socitey idea, the ability to communicate with those around them.
It is a reality, but a distant reality.
Perfect ehh, Getty??
Maby im in denial...but I don't care. I don't believe that machines are taking over, because they cant. No human can create such life (They can give birth, but they cannot create that life.) Why I say i may be in denial, is because I guess its possible that God wanted to create such life then he will, I just don't think he does.
1. adapt to their environment
2. uses the 5 senses
3. feel/show emotions
4. use/retain energy
5. retain/use information
6. communication
7. reproduce
It definetly is a scary truth that machines and robots are becoming more humnlike and soon they will take over the world...haha.
I don't think that right now people have the technology to make a machine that can be human. Machines compared to human standards are not living as seen in Haley's argument. But maybe in the future humanity could be based through machines. If something is human by the standards of growing or repreducing then i don't believe there is a way that machines could be human. But what if a machine wwas made that could feel that could make everyday decisons, what if such a machine could exist. Wouldn't that make it human in a way. If it could feel wouldn't that show a sense of humainty. And if it could make decsions would that show a sign of growth in thinking process? As of now i don't believe we have the techenolgy but maybe in the future if the standards ever were to change it may be possible.
Humanity can't exist without corporeal existance because humanity is corporeal existance; as burning chrome suggests, we may have more than one existance including the corporeal existance and also a cyber existance. This informational existance revolves through our blogs, email, profiles, and web pages.
I find that in order to have this cyber existance there must be a corporeal existance to operate it.
In order for this cyber existance to be separate from a corporeal existance the cyberorganisms must:
1. think
2. have emotions/react
3. sustain themselves(by electricity or otherwise)
4. communicate
5. retain information (stored on hardrive or web server)
6. adapt to different environments
7. reproduce(may or may not be a necesity/can they die?)
I believe that a machine can be as alive as any human because currently it takes a human to build a machine. A machine can only be as smart and can only have characteristics that the person building it has. Machines are going to take over this world because people have gotten to the point where money is more important than humanity. Those people will only live a hundred years as it is so they wont have to see what the have done to destroy humanity. People are greedy so they make machines that are more proficient than others so that they can make money. More and more machines are being built to supposedly make peoples lives easier. When you think about what most people asked for christmas this past year, most of the things that they wanted are machines, electronics,the newest version of video games. Materials items have taken over the old values of family and friends. More and more kids have resorted to video games, internet, cell phones, electronics instead of spending time with family. I believe that humanity will exist only if people try to introduce the old values and maybe reduce the number of new machines and technology being produced each year. I spend a week a year in a deer camp without electricity, a tv, a telephone, hot water, with my boyfriends family. It is probably the best week of each year because it is the most fun. I never even thought shoveling snow for three hours just to make a path to the outhouse could be so much fun. The whole week is spent sharing stories and making huge meals with his family and relatives. We use a generator to power the stove and oven. Other than that we are outside having a good time. I think everyone should have that experience and really realize how much fun they can have with their family and friends and that you don't need to have money and technology to have a happy life. So back on topic, I think that humanity can exist without corporeal existence. People just have to sacrifice some things and stop feeling the need to be rich and have more material items then someone else.
I agree with Haley, the most basic unit of life is a cell. Anything that does not contain cells cannot be considered alive. Living things occur naturally, on their own. They were not made with nuts and bolts or get 500 channels in HD. Machines do not have hearts or souls. They cannot show emotion or create. They react when a human tells them to. You cannot program a living thing.
Machine can never be completely like humans because they do not have cells. Any human is made of DNA that is a given. Scientists can make machines more like humans everyday by giving them human like characteristics such as
1) showing emotion
2) Reaction to situations
3) having the five senses
4) Retaining information
5) Use energy/ retain energy
but what robots can not do is reproduce. Humans reproduce, humans have hearts ( well some do), organs, DNA and that is the difference between robots and humans. They dont have the same "make up". I think that maybe if robots could
1) reproduce
2) Have DNA
then they could be considered humans but not until then. Our society is depending to much on technology as we become more dependent and advanced we will become lazier and the machines we create will take over and do everything for us and that will lead to a situation like wall-e where auto ( he was the auto pilot for the ship on wall-e he over throws the captain) over throws the captian.
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